REPORT 

OF  THE 

SELECT  COMMITTEE  OF  THE  SENATE, 

7 

TO  WHICH  WAS  REFERRED 

THE  ASSEMBLY  BILL  i  BELATIOX  TO  THE  ESTABLISHING 

OF  A 

PUBLIC  PARK 

IN  THE 

CITY  OF  XEW  YORK, 

# 

1853. 

Transmitted  to  the  Legislature,  June  21,  1853. 

ALBANY: 

C.  VAN  BENTHUYSEN,  PRINTER  TO  THE  LEGISLATURE, 

No.  407  Broadway. 

1853. 

iEx  ICtbrtfi 


SEYMOUR  DURST 


'When  you  leave,  please  leave  this  hook 

"Because  it  has  heen  said 
"Ever'thing  comes  t'  him  who  waits 

Except  a  loaned  hook." 


i 


Avery  Architfxtural  and  Fine  Arts  Lu^rary 
Gift  of  Sfymour  B.  Durst  Oi.n  York  Library 


No.  82. 


m  SENATE,  JUNE  21,  1853, 


REPORT 

Of  the  select  committee  on  the  bill  relative  to  a  Public  Park 

in  New-York, 

The  select  committee,  (the  Senator  from  the  first  district 
dissenting,)  to  which  was  referred,  with  power  to  report  comr 
plete,  the  bill  from  the  Assembly,  entitled  "An  act  relative  to 
the  purchase,  possession  and  laying  out  of  certain  lands  for 
a  public  park  in  the  19th  ward  of  the  city  of  New- York,  and 
the  powers  and  duties  of  the  mayor,  aldermen  and  commonalty 
relative  thereto," 

REPORT: 

That  from  the  numerous  petitions  subpoiitted  to  them  by  the 
Senate,  it  is  apparent  that  the  residents  of  New  York  city  are 
very  generally  agreed  as  to  the  necessity  of  some  large  public 
park  in  the  upper  wards.  Since  the  bill  which  passed  the  As- 
sembly on  the  2d  April  last  was  referred  to  your  committee  up 
to  the  date  of  this  report,  about  10,00(i  petitioners,  over  their  own 
proper  signatures,  have  memorialized  the  Legislature,  praying 
that  the  lands  lying  between  66th  and  75th  streets,  and  Third  avenue 
and  the  East  river,  popularly  known  as  Jones'  Wood,  be  laid  out  as 
a  public  park.  During  the  same  time  nearly  nine  thousand  remon- 
strants have  prayed  that  Jones  Wood  be  not  taken  for  such  purpose 
because  it  is  not  sufhciently  central.    Of  these  names,  however, 

[Senate  No.  82.J  1  [u.n.  &50UpJ 


2  [Senate 

over  1100  are  in  the  same  hand-writing  and  without  address,  and 
are,  therefore  doubtful.  Fifty-three  of  these  remonstrants  have, 
at  the  same  time,  prayed  for  the  purchase  of  land  lying  between 
60th  and  105th-streets,  5th  and  8th  avetiues. 

Twelve  other  remonstrants  against  Jones'  Wood  Park,  pray  for 
the  purchase  of  a  central  plot,  "from  about  67th  to  100th  streets.'^ 

The  corporation  of  New- York  have  also  presented  resolutions, 
setting  forth  that  the  proposed  central  park  has  met  the  general 
approbation  of  their  citizens,  that  Jones'  Wood  Park  has  been 
urged  by  "certain  interested  parties,"  without  any  action  of  the 
common  council  in  favor  of  the  same,  and  that  application  be 
made  to  the  Legislature  at  its  present  session  for  a  law  authoriz- 
ing the  opening  of  a  park,  the  boundaries  of  which  shall  be  south- 
erly by  63d-street,  northerly  by  lOOth-street,  easterly  by  the  5th 
avenue,  and  westerly  by  8th  avenue. 

It  will  be  sufficient  to  call  the  attention  of  the  Senate  to  the 
fact  that  the  common  council  of  New-York,  already  infamous  for 
its  corruption  and  venality  in  railroads,  Euss  pavements  and  con- 
tracts, has  been  repudiated  by  its  constituency  at  a  recent  elec- 
tion by  a  vote  of  ten  to  one;  33,000  to  3,000.  Any  recommenda- 
tion  from  such  a  source  may  fairly  be  suspected,  and  your  com- 
mittee do  not  attach  to  it  the  slightest  importance. 

Of  the  nine  thousand  remonstrants,  673  regard  the  present  time 
as  unpropitious  for  such  a  matter  of  mere  luxury,  and  do  not  ask  for 
any  park.  They  say  that  Jones'  Wood  is  more  valuable  than 
land  in  the  centre  of  the  Island.  359  candidly  rest  their  objec- 
tions upon  the  fact  that  Jones'  Wood  is  too  remote  from  their  pro- 
perty. 

Another  remonstrance  emphatically  declaring  that  there  is  not 
one  good  reason  for  making  a  park  at  the  place  in  question,  signed 
by  a  single  remonstrant,  is  remarkable  from  the  fact  that  the 
signer  was  the  counsel  for  the  owners  of  the  land  when  the  law 
of  1851  laying  out  Jones'  Park  was  decided  to  be  invalid  by  Judge 
Edmonds. 


No.  82.]  3 

A  number  of  petitions,  headed  in  English  and  in  German,  for 
a  central  park,"  were  also  referred  to  3  our  committee  on  the  15tli 
June.  IMany  pages  of  the  signatures  are  in  the  same  hand  writ- 
ing, and  without  the  residences  of  the  pretended  signers,  not  less 
than  two  hundred  and  fifteen  names  having  been  counted  in  one  pe- 
tition which  could  not  have  been  genuine. 

In  another  appear  five  hundred  and  twenty-nine  such  names.  A 
third  petition  contains  three  hundred  and  seventy-four.  Another 
petition,  in  English,  signed  by  679  residents  of  New- York,  prays 
for  a  central  park  in  preference  to  Jones'  Woods. 

A  remonstrance  against  Jones'  Wood  Park,  is  signed  by  several 
prominent  citizens  of  New-York,  who  pray  that  a  central  park 
raay  be  laid  out,  and  that  the  expense  of  it  be  borne  as  a  common 
charge.  r 

Another  memorial  asks  for  the  central  park,  provided  its  cost 
shall  not  exceed  fifteen  hundred  thousand  dollars. 

The  petitioners  for  either  park  equal  those  for  the  other  so 
nearly,  that  your  committee  can  only  report  with  certainty  that 
over  18,000  citizens  of  New-York  pray  for  some  large  public  park. 

Your  co&mittee,  thoroughly  impressed  with  the  necessity  of 
public  grounds  to  the  health  and  well  being  of  a  metropolis, 
would  recommend  the  establishment  of  both  the  Jones  and  the 
Central  Park,  if  bills  for  both  were  before  them.  Upon  the  first 
of  these  measures  they  are  now  called  upon  to  decide,  and  they 
have  not  neglected  to  avail  themselves  of  such  information  as  was 
within  their  reach. 

They  have  examined  witnesses  as  to  the  capability  of  the  Jones 
Wood  Park  for  park  purposes  ;  as  to  the  value  of  the  native  fjr- 
est  trees,  when  opened  up  to  the  light  by  paths  and  road- ways  ; 
as  to  the  value  of  the  land  compared  with  that  proposed  to  be 
taken  for  a  central  park ;  as  to  the  advantage  of  a  riverfront,  and 
also  upon  the  topography  of  the  central  site,  and  its  adaptation 
10  public  uses. 


4  [Senate 

Professor  Torrey^  the  well  known  State  botanist  and  geologist, 
testified  that  he  had  been  a  student  of  botany  from  a  boy  ;  that 
he  had  known  Jones'  Woods  all  his  life,  and  visited  them  often 
while  pursuing  his  researches ;  that  the  ground  was  2^  or  3 
miles  from  Union  Square;  that  the  surface  was  varied,  undulat- 
ing, having  a  rocky  shore,  with  a  great  depth  of  water.  Dr.  Tor- 
rey  said  that  a  large  part  of  the  ground  is  well  wooded,  and  knew 
no  reason  why  trees  should  suffer  by  opening  paths.  It  has  not 
been  the  case  in  Greenwood  He  did  not  apprehend  any  danger 
to  the  trees  from  thinning  out,  and  described  them  as  tulip  trees, 
oak,  birch,  hickories,  &c.  He  deems  the  water  front  a  great  ad- 
vantage on  account  of  the  view  and  air,  and  said  that  he  prefers 
the  east  side  of  the  island  to  the  centre  for  a  park,  chiefly  on  ac- 
count of  the  water  and  the  noble  trees.  Dr.  Torrey  thinks  a  park 
would  be  of  great  advantage  to  the  public  health,  and  says  that 
the  high  and  central  parts  of  the  island  are  more  sickly  than  the 
east  side,  and  the  draining  of  Jones'  Wood  is  better  than  of  the 
central  lands.  Dr.  Torrey  described  the  parks  in  London,  which 
he  said  were  frequented  by  all  classes ;  spoke  of  the  deep 
interest  he  felt  in  this  measure  as  a  sanitary  one,  because  Jones' 
Wood  could  be  at  once  converted  into  public  grounds  without 
waiting  for  planted  trees  to  grow. 

Wm.  Currj  a  gardener,  of  35  years  experience  in  and  about 
New-York,  wlio  had  assisted  in  laying  out  Greenwood,  Trinity 
and  ot.her  cemeteries.  Union,  Washington  and  Madison  squares, 
and  Stuyvesant  squares,  testified  that  all  the  city  grounds  were 
originally  quite  bare.  He  had  found  no  difficulty  however  in 
thinning  out  trees  in  cemeteries.  Greenwood  had  not  suffered, 
he  knew  Jones'  Woods  well ;  described  its  surface  as  undulating, 
the  trees  as  large  and  finer  than  at  Greenwood.  Nature,  he  said 
has  made  it  a  park,  and  if  purchased,  one  year  would  render  it 
available  to  the  public.  A  landscape  gardener,  he  said  would 
prefer  ground  covered  with  trees  to  produce  effect,  on  account  of 
time  saved.  Mr.  Curr  decidedly  preferred  Jones'  Woods  to  the 
Central  park. 

Mr.  Riifus  Prime  stated  that  he  was  well  acquainted  with  Jones' 
wood,  having  lived  in  that  vicinity  all  his  life.    He  said  that 


No.  82.]  5 

land  there  was  less  valuable  than  in  the  middle  of  the  island,  as 
he  knew  from  sales  during  the  last  G  months ;  the  value  of  lots 
being  $500  each ;  he  much  preferred  Jones'  wood,  which  in  his 
judgment,  combines  all  the  requisites  for  a  park  ;  he  know  of  no 
purchases  or  speculations  made  with  reference  to  Jones'  wood, 
was  not  himself  interested ;  thinks  a  park  absolutelynece  ssary  in 
New-York  3  and  that  Jones'  wood  will  give  prompt  enjoyment 
in  return  for  the  outlay. 

Mr.  Thomas  Hogg,  being  examined,  stated  that  he  had  been 
well  acquainted  with  Jones'  wood  for  many  years,  and  that  it  can 
be  made  a  park  of  at  a  cheaper  rate  than  any  other  part  of  the 
island ;  the  trees  are  well  grown,  the  land  is  good,  and  there  is  a 
fine  water  front ;  he  had  practiced  horticulture  for  50  years  in 
Great  Britain  and  this  country,  was  certain  that  drives  if  laid 
out  would  not  cause  the  death  of  the  trees  j  has  only  to  refer  to 
Greenwood,  and  Dr.  Hosack's  place  at  Hyde  Park ;  he  thought 
it  would  require  a  very  large  sum  to  render  the  central  park 
available  ;  there  is  a  great  deal  of  swamp;  for  the  present  gene- 
ration Jones'  Wood  is  of  most  advantage. 

Mr.  Benjamin  Munn,  a  landscape  gardner,  had  examined  both 
sites  and  preferred  the  central  one ;  thinks  thinning  the  trees  in 
Jones  wood  might  be  dangerous,  and  would  prefer  the  central 
park  for  the  general  health.  He  had  never  visited  Greenw^ood, 
nor  had  any  experience  in  thinning  out  natural  woods  in  this 
country, nor  had  he  laid  out  any  parks  in  Europe  or  in  America. 

Mr.  James  Hogg,  a  nurseryman  of  20  years'  experience,  stated 
that  he  was  well  acquainted  wath  Jones'  wood,  and  described  the 
trees,  as  oak,  tulip  tree,  liquid  amber,  white  birch,  &c.  He  was  fa- 
miliar with  the  central  park  site  also  :  prefer  Jones'  wood  because 
already  covered  with  trees  and  available.  He  instanced  Mr. 
Wm.  Kelly's,  Dr.  Hosack's  and  Greenwood,  as  places  where 
the  natural  forest  trees  thinned  out,  had  thriven  well.  Mr. 
Hogg  considered  a  park  a  matter  of  necessity  and  quoted  the 
city  inspector's  report  to  show  that  62  per  cent  of  all  deaths, 
occur  under  ten  vears  of  age.  He  stated  that  if  both  sites  were 
bare  of  trees,  the  central  would  cost  most,  that  the  central  is  ad- 
mitted to  be  unhealthy,  that  the  cost  of  laying  out  Jones'  wood, 


6 


I  Senate 


would  be  about  $200  an  acre,  without  fence.  As  to  the  comparative 
cost  of  the  two  sites,  he  stated  that  the  assessed  value  of  Jones' 
wood  for  the  present  year  was  $539,600,  or  an  average  per  block 
of  $14,988,  and  that  the  average  5  blockrj-from  60th  to  67th  streets, 
5th  to  8th  avenues,  was  $31,720.  Mr,  Hogg  produced  a  memo- 
randum of  a  corporation  sale  in  December,  1852,  at  which  the 
average  per  block,  for  land  from  72d  to  78th  streets,  5th  and  7th 
avenues ;  the  site  of  the  proposed  central  park,  was  $67,876,  and 
also  stated  that  22  ]ots  of  ground  on  2d  and  3d  avenues,  and  73d 
streets,  the  most  valuable  part  of  Jones'  woods,  sold  for  an  average 
per  lot  of  $575,  or  per  block,  $36,700. 

Full  notes  of  the  testimony  taken,  accompany  this  repi  rt,  to 
which  appendix  your  committee  would  refer  for  more  minute  de- 
tails. ^ 

Mr.  Samuel  J.  Gustin,  a  gardener  and  nurseryman  of  N'ew- Jer- 
sey, appeared  before  the  chairman  of  the  select  committee  and 
stated  that  his  experience  taught  him  to  prefer  planted  groves  to 
natural  forest,  for  ornamental  purposes.  He  instanced  two  gen- 
tlemen's seats  in  New- Jersey,  one  of  wliich  retained  the  original 
trees,  the  other  had  been  planted  within  30  years ;  the  latter  was 
now  the  most  thrifty.  Mr.  Gustin  thinks  the  central  park  prefer- 
able to  the  other  because  it  will  afford  more  scope  for  the  garden- 
er's art,  for  skilful  and  extensive  planting  and  artistic  effect, 
where  every  thing  is  to  be  created  by  the  landscape  gardener. 

After  carefully  weighing  the  subject  referred  to  them,  your 
committee  were  disposed  to  recommend  to  the  Senate  the  bill  as 
it  came  from  the  Assembly  without  amendment,  as  proper  to  be- 
come a  law.  They  find  that  an  act  was  passed  in  July,  1851, 
which  the  present  one  is  designed  merely  to  revive  and  amend ; 
that  the  land  it  proposes  to  convert  to  the  public  use  is  eminently 
adapted  to  all  the  wants  of  health  and  pleasure;  that  it  will  cost 
only  half  as  much  per  acre,  as  the  central  site ;  that  its  noble  for- 
est trees  will  ajffbrd  immediate  enjoyment  to  the  pent  up  citizens 
of  New-York,  an  enjoyment  which  they  have  prayed  for,  and  are 
willing  to  pay  for.  The  committee  by  no  means  desire  to  inter- 
pose a  single  objection  to  a  larger  and  more  central  park,  wliich 
ought  to  be  established  at  an  early  day,  and  which  they  heartily 


No.  8^1 


7 


recommend  as  a  provision  for  tlie  future.  They  think,  however, 
that  the  present  has  some  claims,  and  that  the  panting  and 
crowded  families  of  the  less  wealthy,  whose  children  fill  the  bills 
of  mortality,  are  entitled  to  ask,  what  has  posterity  done  for  us? 
Why  should  they  be  taxed  now  to  plant  groves,  which  seventy 
years  hence  may  shelter  those  who  come  after  them,  when  health 
and  pure  air,  wafted  from  the  breezy  river,  through  ample  shades, 
are  within  their  present  grasp? 

In  the  words  of  Mr.  William  Curr,  "  the  chief  advantage  of 
Jones'  wood  is,  that  the  trees  are  already  planted,  and  its  being 
available  to  the  present  generation  at  a  small  expense." 

So  earnest  is  th€  opposition  to  this  measure  on  the  part  of  some 
of  the  owners  of  the  land  to  be  taken,  that  your  committee  would 
hesitate  to  urge  it,  from  considerations  of  deference  to  those  who 
see  no  such  public  necessity  in  a  park,  as  would  reconcile  them 
to  the  loss  of  their  land  if  taken  for  a  street,  a  railroad  or  reser- 
voir ;  when  to  this  is  added  a  weight  of  petition  in  favor  of  an- 
other locality  as  strong  as  that  which  prays  for  Jones'  Wood, 
it  seems,  perhaps,  wisest  to  refer  to  the  new  city  government  of 
New- York  the  choice  of  sites. 

Your  committee^  impressed  with  the  great  deficiency  of  New- 
York  in  public  grounds,  would  recommend  the  purchase  of  both, 
or,  perhaps,  the  securing  of  one,  without  delay,  and  the  other,  at 
the  option  of  the  city. 

From  a  recent  work  on  the  parks,  gardens,  &:c.,  of  London  and 
its  suburbs,  by  Edward  Kemp,  1851,  it  appears  that  the  well 
known  St.  James  park,  contains  but  87  acres,  and  the  Green  park 
adjoining,  and  separated  only  by  a  street,  (the  Mall,)  is  an  open 
area  of  56  acres.  Both  together  they  cover  but  143  acres,  less 
than  Jones'  wood,  which  occupies  156  acres. 

"  JiOndon,"  says  Kemp,  "  like  most  other  large  and  populous 
towns,  has  gradually  spread  itself  so  completely  over  the  open 
spaces  which  formerly  surrounded  it,  that  it  is  now,  as  respects 
the  number  of  its  inhabitants,  by  no  means  liberally  supplied 
with  breathing  places,  or  the  means  of  open  air  recreation.  And 
this  encroachment  on  its  suburbs  has  been  elfected  with  such 


8  [Senate 

comparative  slowness,  and  so  silently,  tliat  it  is  only  by  the  oc- 
currence of  modern  epidemics,  producing  that  attention  to  sanita- 
ry njiitters  v>hich  forms  such  a  prominent  feature  of  the  present 
age,  that  tlie  necessity  for  good  public  parks  has  been  d^ly  re- 
cognized, and  the  insufficiency  of  those  already  existing,  properly 
felt.  Attention  having,  however,  been  awakened  to  the  matter^ 
the  evil  has  already  been  la  part  remedied,  and  further  provision; 
for  meeting  the  public  wants  is  in  process  of  being  made.  There 
are  also  many  open  commons  in  the  vicinity  of  the  metropolis 
which;  as  Ave  shall  afterwards  show,  answer  all  the  purposes  of 
parks." 

Let  us  see  how  many  acres  of  parks  and  commons  are  now 
open  to  the  Londoner.  Lying  within  London  itself,  there  are 

St.  James  park,   87  acres, 

Green  park,.  „.   56  " 

Hyde  park,   349  " 

Regents,..   450  « 

Greenwich,   200  <^ 

Victoria,  ,   300 

1,412  " 

and  at  Lambeth,on  the  other  side  of  the  Thames,  Battersea  parky 
200  acres.  No  mention  is  made  of  the  "  squares"  which  resemble 
the  Washington  or  Union  squares  of  New- York,  and  are  deemed 
too  small  for  notice.  Then  ten  miles  from  London,  are  Rich- 
mond Hill  and  park,  2,25iJ  acres,  Windsor  park,  divided  into  little 
park,  500  acres,  Great  Park,  1,800=2,300  acre? ;  and  wiihin  one 
hour's  ride  by  railroad.  Close  by  the  city,  and  stretching,  says 
Kemp,  in  a  kind  of  chain,  n  me  of  them  being  more  than  a  mile 
apart,  beginning  with  Kensington  com  men,  a  famous  cricket  ground 
quite  in  London^  are  Ciapham  common,  W^andsworth  common, 
Tooting  common,  Streatham  common,  Mitcham  common,  Wimble- 
don common,  alone  containing  about  1,000  acres,  Pultney  heath, 
Barnes'  common,  Hempstead  Heath — comprising  among  them  all 
several  thousands  of  acres.  Then  there  are  many  public  gardens^ 
w^here,as  in  Kensington  gardens,  beneath  one  immense  and  almost 
continuous  mass  of  shade,  the  public  may  freely  enjoy  the  most 
luxurious  summer  rambles.    They  are  admitted  to 


No.  82.] 


9 


Kensington  gardens  which  at  present  cover  nearly  300  acres. 

Royal  Botanic  gardens,  Kew,  75  acres. 

Kew  pleasure  grounds,  130  acres. 

Horticultural  Society's  garden,  Chiswick. 

Royal  Botanic  gardens,  Regents'  Park,  18  acres. 

Chelsea  Botanic  gardens. 

Temple  gardens,  London. 

Hampton  Court  gardens. 

Beulah  Spa,  Norwood,  7  miles  from  London. 

Not  including  the  numerous  Commons,  more  than  seven  thou- 
sand acres  of  park  and  garden  are  open  to  the  London  public. 
The  commons  offer  not  less  than  four  or  five  thousand  acres  mdre 
to  the  unrestricted  use  and  abuse,  if  it  be  possible,  of  the  towna 
people.  How  does  this  ample  provision  of  breathing  places,  for 
a  population  of  2,300,000,  compare  with  New-York  ?  London 
gives  to  every  100,000  five  hundred  acres  of  public  pleasure 
ground.  New- York,  with  over  600,000  inhabitants,  has  now 
hardly  100  acres,  reckoning  Battery,  City-Hall  Park,  all  the  squares 
and  Mt.  Morris;  to  eke  out  the  aggregate — sixteen  acres  to  the 
hundred  thousand  of  population. 

By  a  sad^want  of  forethought,  akin  to  that  simplicity  which 
constructed  the  rear  of  the  City  Hall  towards  Chamber  street,  of 
brown  stone,  because  that  side  being  towards  the  country  where 
it  would  never  be  seen,  white  marble  would  have  been  wasted, 
the  noble  Harlem  commons  have  been  sold,  block  after  block, 
until  now  hardly  a  fraction  remains.  The  rivers,  it  was  supposed, 
were  lungs  enough.  The  ferry  boats  would  carry  people  to 
the  Elysian  Fields,  to  the  waste,  unoccupied  lands  on  the  heights 
of  Brooklyn,  or  possibly  they  might  for  all  ages  find  solitude  to 
ramble  unchecked  by  the  vicinity  of  dwellings  over  the  hills  of 
Staten  Island.  The  tide  of  population  has^  however,  risen  ovcj. 
all  the- shores  around  the  American  metropolis.  Our  health  seek- 
ing citizen  is  repelled  by  red  bricks  and  garden  palings  at  Hobo- 
ken  a:id  Jersey  city,  at  Quarantine,  at  Stapleton,  or  at  New 
Brighton,  w'.iUe  Brooklyn  (herself  a  Liverpool),  has  no  vacant 
land  for  the  recreation  of  her  own  peojde.  We  must  therefore 
give  now  to  New- York  a  great  park.    Her  growth,  her  wealth, 


10 


[Senate 


her  fature  demand  it,  and  the  present  will  probably  be  the  last 
opportunity  to  give  what  she  demands. 

The  right  of  eminent  domain,  it  has  been  held,  is  not  a  pow- 
er to  be  delegated.  Such  however  has  npt  been  the  doctrine  of  the 
State  of  New-York.  The  general  railroad  law  for  instance,  dele- 
gates this  sovereignty  to  any  association  who  may  form  under  its 
provisions,  and  permits  persons  not  designated,  to  take  lands  not 
named  or  described.  Nor  is  the  pub  ic  necessity  made  a  condi- 
tion, for  as  in  the  case  of  the  Mohawk  valley  R.  R.  a  line  may  be 
surveyed  and  recorded,  and  the  land  of  the  private  owner  seized 
upon,  because  the  profits  of  a  company  may  make  it  their  interest 
to  change  their  route  for  the  convenience  of  a  part  of  their  business. 

Your  committee  therefore  feel  that  they  are  advising  no  new  or 
hazardous  exercise  of  sovereignty  on  the  part  of  the  State,  in  re- 
commending, should  the  Senate  not  pass  the  Assembly  bill  esta- 
blishing Jones'  Wood  as  a  park,  the  conferring  upon  the  city  cor- 
poration of  New- York,  to  be  elected  at  the  next  election  in  No- 
vember next,  full  power  to  determine  by  commissioners,  what 
lands  they  shall  take,  and  by  another  set  of  commissioners,  to 
value  and  pay  for  the  lands  so  chosen,  for  a  public  park.  The 
measure  sent  up  by  the  Assembly  is  not  a  new  one.  An  act  simi- 
lar to  this  bill,  became  a  law  in  July  1851,  but  on  account  of 
some  constitutional  objections  Judge  Edmonds  declined  to  ap- 
point commissioners  of  award  and  assessment  to  carry  it  into  ef- 
fect. Good  lawyers  have  held  opposite  opinions,  and  it  was 
apparently  with  a  view  to  give  vitality  to  an  existing  statute, 
that  the  Assembly  have  passed  the  present  bill. 

^Willing  to  leave  to  those  most  nearly  interested,  the  choice  be- 
tween the  conflictin  o-  sites  for  public  parks  in  the  city  of  New- 
York,  which  have  been  brought  before  the  Legislature,  the  com- 
mittee beg  leave  to  submit  some  amendments,  with  which,  in 
discharge  of  the  duty  imposed  upon  them  by  the  Senate,  they 
report  the  bill  complete  and  recommend  its  passage. 
Mhany,  June  21,  1853. 

JAMES  W.  BEEKMAN, 
HENRY  E.  BARTLETT, 


TESTIMONY^ 


EXAMINATION  OF  MR.  Wm.  CURR. 

June  1st,  1853.  • 
Question  1st.  What  is  your  profession? 
A.  A  gardener. 

Q.  2d.  How  many  years  have  you  been  so  engaged  1 

A.  Upwards  of  forty  years,  thirty  five  of  which  have  been  in 
the  city  of  New-York. 

Q.  3d.  Have  you  had  any  experience  in  laying  out  grounds  as 
a  landscape  gardener. 

A.  Yes,  assisted  in  laying  out  Greenwood,  Trinity  Cemetery, 
and  laid  ouj  all  the  city  parks,  except  the  Battery,  the  City  Hall, 
and  St.  John's  Square. 

Q.  4th.  What  grounds  have  you  so  laid  out  1 

A.  Union  Square,  Madison  Square,  Tompkins  Square,  Stuyve- 
sant  Square,  and  others. 

Q.  5th.  W^ere  these  grounds  thickly  covered  with  trees,  or 
were  they  quite  bare  1 

A.  They  were  bare,  Greenwood  was  thickly  covered  with  trees, 
as  also  was  Trinity  Cemetery. 

Q.  6.  In  laying  out  grounds  thickly  covered  with  trees,  where 
you  have. had  to  cut  away  large  numbers  of  them,  in  order  to 
make  walks,  &c.,  have  you  found  any  disastrous  efiects  to  ensue 
10  those  that  are  left  ? 

A.  No !  I  have  never  experienced  any,  where  proper  care  was 
exercised,  have  never  under  such  circumstances  lost  any  myself. 


12  [Senate 
Q.  7.  Are  the  trees  so  left  apt  to  die  ? 

A.  No !  they  are  not  apt  to  die,  unless  jou  cut  away  a  very 
large  space,  when  some  of  the  surrounding  trees  might  perhaps 
die,  but  not  if  only  paths  are  cut  away^  or  they  are  merely  thin- 
ned out. 

Q.  8.  Were  Greenwood  and  Trinity  Cemetery  much  injured  by 
having  the  trees  thinned  out  1 
A.  No,  they  were  not. 

Q.  9.  Are  you  acquainted  with  the  grounds  on  New- York 
Island,  known  as  Jones'  Woods? 

A.  Yes,  I  have  known  them  for  the  past  thirty  years. 
Q.  10.  Have  you  been  over  it  ? 

A.  Yes,  frequently,  on  botanical  excursions,  hunting  for  plants. 
Q.  11.  What  is  the  general  character  of  the  surface? 
A.  Undulating,  the  whole  surface  of  the  Island  is  undulating. 
Q.  12.  What  is  the  character  and  general  description  of  the 
trees  upon  it  ? 

A.  Large,  consisting  of  liquid  amber,  oaks,  tulip  trees,  and 
others,  also  many  species  of  shrubs,  as  the  dogwood,  the  libur- 
Hum,  &c. 

Q.  13.  What  is  the  relative  position  of  the  grounds,  as  to  the 
surrounding  grade  of  the  streets,  can  it  be  made  to  accord  with 
such  grade  without  much  expense  ? 

A.  In  some  places  is  below,  in  others  above  the  grade,  on  the 
2d.  av.,  is  in  some  parts  above,  in  some  below  the  grade,  could 
by  terraces  or  embankments  be  made  to  accord  with  surrounding 
grade  very  readily. 

Q.  14.  What  are  your  views  as  to  its  capability  for  being  im- 
proved and  laid  out  as  a  public  park  1 

A.  Nature  has  already  made  it  a  park,  at  a  little  expense  it 
could  be  made  a  most  splendid  affair. 

Q.  15.  If  purchased,  how  long  a  time  would  it  probably  take 
to  make  it  available  to  the  public  as  a  park  ? 

A  One  year  would  make  it  available. 


No.  82. J  13 

Q.  16.  Aside  from  the  purchase  money  and  the  amount  neces- 
sary to  enclose  it,  what  amount  would  probably,  in  your  opinion, 
be  necessary  to  render  it  so  available  in  the  time  you  name  ? 

A.  About  ten  or  fifteen  thousand  dollars. 

Q.  17.  Are  you  acquainted  with  the  grounds  proposed  to  be 
taken  for  what  is  called  the  Central  Park  ? 

A.  Yes. 

Q.  18.  Hare  you  been  over  it? 
A.  Yes. 

Q  19.  What  is  the  general  character  of  the  surface? 
A.  Very  undulating ;  some  parts  very  high,  some  very  low, 
but  very  rocky. 

Q  20.  What  is  the  general  character  and  general  description  of 
the  trees  upon  it  ? 

A.  It  is  almost  entirely  bare  of  trees,  they  having  been  cut 
down  several  years  ago. 

Q  21 .  What  is  the  general  position  of  the  ground  as  to  the  sur- 
rounding grade  of  the  streets  ?  Can  it  be  made  to  accord  with 
such  grade  without  much  expense  ? 

A.  In  some  places  it  is  very  high, in  others  very  low;  in  many 
parts  it  w^oi:^d  have  to  be  filled  up,  should  consider  at  great  ex- 
pensQ,  but  does  not  know  at  what  cost. 

Q  22.  What  are  your  views  as  to  its  capability  for  being  im- 
proved and  laid  out  as  a  public  park  ? 

A.  It  could  be  made  a  fine  park,  but  would  cost  a  great  sum 
and  many  years  to  make  it  available. 

Q  23.  If  purchased  how  long  a  time  would  it  probably  take  to 
make  it  available  to  the  public  as  a  park? 

A.  A  great  many  years,  perhaps  fifty  or  sixty  before  the  trees 
would  be  as  fine  or  as  large  as  those  in  Jones'  woods. 

Q  24.  Aside  from  the  purchase  money  and  the  amount  neces- 
sary to  enclose  it,  what  amount  would  probably,  in  your  opinion, 
be  necessary  to  render  it  available  ? 


14  [Senate 

A.  I  have  not  made  any  calculation,  the  amount,  however, 
would  be  very  great. 

Q  25.  In  laying  out  grounds,  which  would  give  you,  as  a  land- 
scape gardener,  the  best  opportunity^of  displaying  your  skill, 
grounds  covered  with  trees  as  Jones'  woods,  or  gruonds  entirely 
bare  as  the  proposed  central  park  ? 

A.  I  would  much  prefer  ground  covered  with  trees  on  account 
of  the  time  saved,  in  this  case  particularly,  as  there  are  many 
trees  growing  which  it  is  difficult  to  procure  and  to  transplant, 
the  liriodendron,  the  liquid  amber  and  the  white  oak  for  in- 
stance. 

Q  26.  Would  the  present  and  proposed  new  croton  reservoirs 
be  desirable  objects  in  a  park  ? 

A.  I  should  think  not;  they  would  be  very  unsightly  objects. 

Q  27.  Would  tkey  materially  interfere  with  the  general  design 
of  a  park  1 

A.  They  would ;  it  would  be  difficult  to  bring  them  into  the 
general  design. 

Q  28.  What,  in  your  opinion  as  a  landscape  gardener,  are  the 
comparative  merits  of  the  two  localities  for  the  purpose  to  which 
it  is  proposed  to  appropriate  them? 

A.  I  should  most  decidedly  prefer  Jones'  wood ;  it  is  covered 
with  trees  and  is  immediately  available  at  a  small  expense.  The 
central  park  is  without  trees,  would  take  many  years  to  be  made 
available,  and  would  require  a  great  outlay  of  money. 

Q  29.  Would  there  be  much  difference  to  the  neighborhood  as 
to  the  respective  localities  1 

A.  There  would  not  be  much  difference  of  convenience  to  the 
neighborhood,  whether  the  park  were  central  or  not 

Q  30.  Would  this  Jones'  wood  park  be  likely  to  benefit  the 
property  around  it  ? 

A.  It  would  certainly  improve  the  adjoining  property,  but  so 
would  the  central  park ;  the  improvement  would  not  be  more  in 
one  case  than  the  other. 

Q  31.  How  long  would  it  require  for  trees  now  planted  to  be- 
come ornamental  1 


No.  82J  15 

A.  That  can  be  answered  by  taking  Union  Square  as  an  exam- 
ple; it  was  planted  in  1837  or  1838,  sixteen  years  ago,  also 
Washington  Square  laid  out  in  1829. 

Q  32.  When  were  the  first  trees  planted  in  Washington  Square? 

A.  In  1829  and  1830. 

Q  33.  If  trees  were  thinned  out  so  as  to  allow  the  grass  to 
grow  under  them,  would  they  die  ? 

A.  No,  they  would  not  die  if  thinned  out  judiciously. 
Q  34.  How  is  the  soil  of  Jones'  wood  1 

A.  It  is  generally  very  deep  and  well  calculated  for  the  growth 
of  trees. 

Q  35.  Is  Jones'  Wood  as  thickly  covered  with  trees  as  Green- 
wood w^as  1 

A.  Yes,  about  the  same. 

Q  36.  Do  the  trees  in  Jones'  Wood  differ  much  in  their 
growth  and  general  appearance  from  those  in  Greenwood  ? 

A.  The  trees  in  Greenw^ood  are  much  more  stunted  in  their 
appearance  than  those  in  Jones'  Wood. 

Q  37.  How  far  from  the  centre  of  the  city,  or  the  thickly 
settled  porti^Dn  of  it,  as  around  Union-square,  is  Jones'  Wood  situ- 
ated? 

A.  About  three  miles  from  Union-square. 

Q  38.    What  was  the  cost  of  the  fence  around  Union-square. 

A.  I  do  not  exactly  recollect,  but  think  it  was  somewhere  in 
the  neighborhood  of  forty-thousand  dollars. 

Q  39.  Would  not  Jones'  Wood  require  an  equally  expensive 
fence  to  enclose  it  ? 

A.    No  ;  a  lighter  one  would  be  far  better.    The  fence  around 
Union-square  is  in  very  bad  taste ;  it  is  too  heavy,  and  too  prison 
like  in  its  appearance. 

Q  40.  What  is  the  comparative  size  of  Union-square  and 
Jones'  Wood '? 


16  [Senate 

A.  Union-square  contains  about  four  acres,  and  Jones'  Wood 
contains  about  one  hundred  and  fifty  acres. 

Q.  41.  Could  this  park  be  laid  out  for  less  than  a  million  of 
dollars  ? 

A.  I  should  think  so.  It  might  be  laid  out  for  ten  or  fifteen 
thousand  dollars. 

Q.  42.  What  advantage  would  a  park  be  to  the  citizens  at 
large  ? 

A.  It  would  be  a  very  great  advantage  to  the  whole  city,  as 
affording  means  of  recreation  to  the  mass  of  the  people,  and  as  an 
ornament. 

Q.  43.  Are  there  not  already  sufficient  places  provided  for 
such  purposes  1 

A.  No,  there  are  not.  The  present  park  and  squares  are  all 
thoroughfares,  and  laid  out  in  straight  lines,  Avhereas  Jones'  Wood 
would  be  rural,  like  the  country. 

Q.  44.  Does  Jones'  Wood  possess  any  advantages  over  the 
Central  Park,  as  to  healthiness  i 

A.  I  do  not  know,  as  to  general  health  of  the  city.  The  same 
advantages  would  result  from  the  Central  Park  as  from  the 
Jones'  Wood. 

fJQ.  45.  The  fence  being  equal,  would  it  cost  more  to  plant  th^ 
Central  Park  than  Jones'  Wood. 

A.  It  of  course  would  cost  very  much  less  to  plant  Jones' 
Wood,  for  the  trees  are  already  there. 

Q.  46.  Is  the  water  deep  and  available  for  commercial  pur 
poses  on  the  East  river  front  of  the  Jones  Wood  ? 

A.  Yes ;  the  water  is  deep,  and  I  suppose  it  might  be  used  for 
commerce. 

Q.  47.  Does  this  water  front  offer  any  advantages  to  the  Jones 
Wood  as  aifecting  its  being  more  healthy  than  the  central  park? 

A.  I  do  not  think  but  what  the  central  park  would  be  healthy 
enough,  but  the  Jones'  Wood  has  the  advantage  of  a  river  breeze, 
and  this,  with  the  beauty  of  the  water  view,  would  make  me  pre- 
fer it. 


No.  82.]  17 

Q.  48  What  do  you  consider  the  chief  advantage  of  Jones 
Wood? 

A.  The  chief  advantage  is  the  trees  being  already  planted, 
and  its  being  available  to  the  present  generation  at  a  small  ex- 
pense. 

Q  49.  Do  you  know  any  thing  as  to  the  value  of  this  pro- 
perty ? 

A.  I  do  not ;  I  only  speak  of  the  expense  as  connected  with 
the  laying  of  it  out. 

Q  50.    Do  you  know  who  are  the  owners  of  this  Jones  Wood 
property  ] 
A.    I  do  not. 

Q  51.    Who  induced  you  to  come  here? 
A.    Mr.  James  Hogg. 

Q  52.    Has  he  held  out  any  pecuniary  recompense,  or  promise 
as  to  your  laying  it  out,  should  it  be  obtained? 
A.    He  has  not. 

Q  53.  Have  you  remarked  that  wherever  paths  or  roads 
have  been  laid  out  by  the  owners  of  the  Jones*  Wood,  the  trees 
have  died  ? 

A.  I  have' not  remarked  it. 

Q  54.  Would  not  the  Jones  Wood  with  its  line  deep  soil  and 
splendid  trees,  be  far  more  costly  to  purchase  than  an  equal  area 
of  the  central  park  with  its  great  ledges  of  rock  ? 

A.  I  do  not  know,  it  would  depend  somewhat  upon  the  value 
of  the  stone. 

June  \st^  1853.    Eocamination  of  Mr.  Rufus  Prime. 

Q  1.  Are  you  acquainted  with  ground  proposed  to  be  conver- 
ted into  Jones'  park  ? 

A.  Yes,  I  am  well  acquainted  with  it,  have  lived  in  that  vici- 
nity all  my  life. 

Q  2.  Is  it  more  or  less  valuable  than  the  ground  that  would 
be  occupied  by  the  central  park  ? 

[Senate,  No.  82.  J  2 


18  [Senate 

A.  It  is  less  valuable  ;  lots  in  the  centre  of  the  island  are  more 
valuable  than  those  on  the  east  side  j  I  judge  from  sales  made 
within  the  last  six  months. 

Q  3.  Which  in  your  judgment  would  be  the  most  desirable  for 
a  park? 

A.  Jones'  Wood,  most  certainly,  because  it  is  already  well 
wooded  and  is  near  the  river. 

Q  4.  What  is  the  value  of  the  lots  there  ? 

A.  I  have  recently  sold  about  twenty  acres  on  86th  and  87th 
streets,  from  1st  avenue  to  the  river, at  $500  per  lot,  or  $6,000  per 
acre. 

Q  5.  Which  would  most  promote  the  convenience  of  the  pub- 
lic, the  central  park  or  Jones'  W^ood  ? 

A.  The  object  of  a  park  for  the  convenience  of  the  public 
would  be  most  promoted  by  Jones'  Wood,  for  it  combines  all  the 
requisites  of  a  park  already,  the  trees  only  requiring  to  be  thinned 
out  as  at  Greenwood. 

Q  6.  Are  you  interested  in  the  neighborhood  of  Jones'  Wood. 

A.  No,  not  at  present ;  have  parted  with  my  interest  in  pro- 
perty in  that  neighborhood. 

Q  7.  Will  you  not  be  taxed  for  the  park  ? 

A.  Yes,  and  as  a  property  holder,  I  have  found  citizens  willing 
and  ready  to  be  taxed  for  this  purpose.  For  some  years  public 
attention  has  been  drawn  to  it,  and  people  have  regarded  it  as  a 
very  desirable  thing,  being  well  wooded  and  immediately  availa- 
ble. 

Q  8.  Have  purchases  of  land  been  made  for  speculative  pur- 
poses growing  out  of  this  proposed  park  at  Jones'  Wood  ? 

A.  No  ;  no  purchases  of  land  on  speculation  have  been  made,  ari- 
sing out  of  the  proposed  Jones'  Wood  ;  at  least  I  am  not  aware 
of  any. 

Q  9.  What  is  the  character  of  the  river  opposite  Jones'  Wood? 

A.  Blackwell's  Island  being  opposite  you  cannot  dock  out  very 
far,  the  tide  runs  very  strong,  the  water  is  very  deep. 

Q  10.  Do  you  think  it  would  be  necessary  to  enclose  Jones' 
Wood  with  an  expensive  fence  ? 


N.  82.] 


19 


A.  I  do  not  think  that  an  expensive  fence  is  at  all  necessary. 
Indeed  a  fence  is  not  indispensable,  there  is  none  at  the  Bosch,  at 
the  Hague,  and  if  I  recollect  aright  there  is  none  at  the  Champs 
Elysee  at  Paris. 

Q  11 .  Do  you  think  a  park  is  necessary  ? 
A.  Yes,  it  is  absolutely  necessary. 

Q  12.  Do  you  think  that  in  New- York  especially  we  are  in 
need  of  parks. 

A.  Yes,  our  mechanics  and  working  men  need  it  as  a  place  of 
recreation  for  themselves  and  their  families. 

Q  13.  What  would  be  the  effect  of  the  park  upon  the  prop- 
erty immediately  adjoining,  as  to  buildings,  &c.  ? 

A.  I  cannot  say  what  kind  of  residences  would  be  built, 
whether  extravagant  buildings  would  be  erected  or  not, 

Q  14.  Why  would  you  prefer  Jones'  Wood  to  the  central 
park  ? 

A.  I  prefer  Jones'  Wood  because  we  get  immediate  returns  for 
the  outlay,  the  present  generation  will  have  the  enjoyment  of  it, 
and  I  think  that  unless  now  obtained  we  shall  regret  it  hereafter. 

June  9thj  1853.    Examination  of  Dr.  John  Torrey. 
Q  1.    Whjt  is  your  profession? 

A.  I  am  professor  of  Botany  and  Chemistry  in  the  New- York 
Medical  College,  was  educated  as  a  physician. 

Q  2.  What  experience  hav6  you  had  in  horticultural  mat- 
ters ? 

A.    I  have  been  studying  botany  from  a  boy. 

Q  3.    Are  you  acquainted  with  Jones'  Woods  ? 

A.    Yes,  I  have  known  them  from  a  boy 

Q  4.    How  are  they  situated  ? 

A.    On  the  3d  av.  and  East  river  about  70th-street- 

Q  5.  How  far  are  they  from  the  Union  Square,  or  from  Har- 
lem? 

A.  I  do  not  positively  know,  perhaps  2^  or  3  miles  from 
Union  Square,  perhaps  2  or  3  miles  south  of  Harlem,  they  are 
very  nearly  5  miles  from  the  City  Hall. 


20  [Senate 

Q  6.    What  is  the  aspect  of  the  ground? 

A.  It  is  very  varied,  undulating,  a  small  portion  rocky,  part 
laying  low,  the  shore  is  partly  rocky,  which  is'very  steep,  with 
quite  a  considerable  depth  of  water. 

Q  7.    What  is  the  nature  of  the  trees  in  Jones'  W^ood  ? 

A.  A  large  part  of  the  ground  is  well  wooded  with  trees  of 
unusual  size. 

Q  8.  Would  not  these  trees  be  injured  by  having  paths  and 
roads  cut  through  them  ?  . 

A.  I  do  not  see  why  they  should  sutfer  by  opening  paths  thro' 
them,  it  has  not  been  the  case  in  other  grounds.  I  have  seen 
many  cemeteries  where  the  natural  trees  remained  and  flourished 
notwithstanding  paths  and  roads  were  cut  through  them. 

Q.  9  In  rocky  situations  where  the  soil  is  thin  would  they  not 
be  likely  to  suffer  1 

A.  Yes,  if  the  soil  was  thin  and  rocky  the  sun  might  affect 
them  unfavorably,  but  in  these  w^oods  the  soil  is  generally  deep, 
the  rocky  portions  contain  many  crevices  which  are  deep  and 
filled  with  earth,  in  which  many  trees  of  considerable[size  are 
growing. 

Q.  10  Would  you  apprehend  any  danger  from  thinning  out 
these  woods  ? 

A.    No,  I  should  not  apprehend  any. 

Q.  11    Is  there  any  great  variety  of  trees  in  Jones'  Wood  ? 

A.  Yes,  there  is  a  great  variety  of  our  ordinary  native  forest 
trees,  among  them  are  some  very  fine  specimens  of  oaks,  tulip 
tree^  liquid  amber,  hickories,  birch,  and  some  cedars. 

Q  12.  Do  you  consider  a  water  front  of  any  advantage  to  a 
park  ? 

A.  Yes,  I  consider  it  a  very  great  advantage,  on  account  of 
the  view,  a  free  circulation  of  air,  &c. 

Q.  13.  How  wide  is  the  river  at  Jones'  Wood  and  do  vessels 
of  any  size  navigate  it  ? 

A.  The  river  between  Jones'  wood  and  Blackwell's  Island 
which  is  opposite,  is  about  J  of  a  mile  in  width,  steamers  and 
other  vessels  often  go  through  it. 


No.  82.J  21 

Q  14.    Are  you  acquainted  with  the  proposed  central  park? 

A.  I  am  not  acquainted  with  its  proposed  boundaries,  but 
know  the  region  between  6th  and  7th  avenue,  up  as  far  as  86th 
or  90th  street. 

Q  15.    What  is  its  general  character? 

A.  As  compared  with  Jones's  Wood  it  is  far  more  rocky,  the 
soil  thinner,  the  rocks  project  more  above  the  surface,  are  more 
bald,  and  unpicturesque. 

Q  16.  Is  the  depth  of  soil  in  Jones'  Wood  sufficient  for  the 
growth  of  trees  ? 

A.    I  should  think  it  was  quite  sufficient. 

Q  17.  What  is  the  character  of  the  water  front  of  Jones' 
Wood? 

A.    The  shore  edge  is  rocky. 

Q  18.  How  have  you  ascertained  that  soil  in  Jones'  Wood  is 
deep? 

A.    I  should  infer  so  from  the  size  of  the  trees. 

Q  19.    Is  there  any  undergrowth  in  Jones'  Wood  ? 

A.  Yes ;  there  is  much  shrubbery,  such  as  dogwood,  vibur- 
num, &c. 

Q  20.  Is  ffot  the  central  part  of  the  island  higher  than  Jones' 
Wood  ? 

A.  Y 61$ ;  it  is  generally  higher,  but  has  a  great  deal  of  bald 
rock. 

Q  21 .  Why  do  you  prefer  the  east  side  to  the  centre  of  the 
island  ? 

A.  I  prefer  the  east  side  chiefly  on  account  of  the  water  front 
and  the  noble  trees^  and  very  much  doubt  whether  the  centre 
could  be  improved  without  enormous  expense. 

Q  22.    Is  there  any  difficulty  in  raising  up  young  trees  ? 

A.  I  have  not  known  any  difficulty  in  raising  trees  where  per- 
sons have  selected  prop3r  spots  to  raise  them. 

Q  23.  Would  a  park  improve  the  proi>erty  in  the  neighbar- 
hood? 


22  [Senate 

A.  1  should  suppose  that  the  creation  of  a  park  would  be  of 
advantage,  and  would  very  much  improve  the  value  of  property 
in  the  vicinity. 

Q  24.  Do  you  think  the  park  wQuld  benefit  the  property  in 
the  lower  part  of  the  city  ? 

A.  I  am  not  capable  of  judging  as  to  the  commercial  part  o^ 
the  city,  but  as  to  private  residences  I  should  think  it  T^ould. 

Q  25.  Would  a  park  be  of  any  sanitary  advantage  to  the 
public  ? 

A.  I  think  it  would  be  of  great  advantage  to  the  public  health. 

Q  36.  Do  you  know  the  general  condition  of  the  country 
around  Jones'  wood  as  to  healthiness  ? 
A.  Yes. 

Q  27.  State  what  it  was,  or  is. 

A.  It  was  formerly  unhealthy,  but  now  these  parts  are  in  some 
portions  as  healthy  as  around  Union  Square.  On  the  east  side  of 
the  island  it  is  now  more  healthy  than  on  the  central  part,  which 
have  always  been  more  unhealthy,  the  high  and  central  parts 
have  been  more  sickly.  At  the  Deaf  and  Dumb  Institution  they 
suffered  from  fever  and  ague  arising  from  stagnant  water  in  the 
centre  of  the  island. 

Q  28.  Did  not  intermittent  fever  prevail  in  the  lower  part  of 
the  island  ? 

A.  Yes,  it  formerly  prevailed  in  Greenwich  village,  and 
around  Lispenards'  meadows,  now  Canal-street. 

Q  29.  Were  there  any  swamps  near  the  Deaf  and  Dumb  In- 
stitution ? 

A.  Yes,  they  were  the  seat  of  diseases.  On  Yorkville  heights 
there  are  stagnant  ponds. 

Q  30.  Does  not  building  up  a  city  improve  its  health  ( 
A.  The  city,  generally,  has  improved  in  health  since  it  was 
built  up. 

Q  31.  Are  not  smaller  or  more  level  parks  more  healthy  than 
larger  ones  ? 

A.  No;  larger  parks  are  all  drained  by  their  natural  drainage, 
a  dead  level  spot  could  hardly  be  allowed. 


No.  82.] 


Q  32.    Are  there  not  swamps  in  Jones'  woods  ? 

A.  Yes,  there  is  some  swampy  land  ;  but  the  natural  drainage 
of  Jones'  wood  is  better  than  the  central  part ;  the  swampy  land 
may  be  more  readily  drained. 

Q  33.    Would  you  consider  the  reservoirs  as  unhealthy? 

A.    No,  I  shquld  not. 

Q  34.    Are  you  acquainted  with  the  parks  in  London '? 
A.  Yes. 

Q  35o    Do  you  know  whether  they  are  fenced  in. 

A.  I  do  not  recollect  whether  they  are  all  fenced  in,  some  are, 
however,  with  iron  fencing. 

Q  36.  What  is  the  character  of  the  surface  of  the  parks  in 
London  ? 

A.  The  London  parks  are  more  level  than  the  surface  of  New- 
York  island ;  the  trees  are  more  scattered,  being  planted  in  clumps 
or  avenues,  with  grass  under  them. 

Q  37.    Are  they  much  thought  of  by  the  citizens? 
A     Yes,,  they  are  very  much  esteemed  by  the  public. 

Q  38.    Are  they  much  surrounded  with  residences? 
A.    Yes,  it  is  densely  populated  all  around  them. 

Q  39.    By  whom  are  they  chiefly  frequented  ? 
A.    They  are  frequented  by  all  classes,  rich  and  poor,  who 
generally  go  better  dressed  than  usual,  when  they  visit  them. 

Q  40.  In  what  light  do  the  people  of  New- York  regard  this 
Jones  Wood  park  ? 

A.  I  do  not  know  positively  how  they  regard  it ;  but  as  tar  as 
know,  it  is  very  much  desired  by  them. 

Q  41.    Do  you  take  much  interest  in  this  matter? 
A.    Yes,  I  take  a  deep  interest  in  it,  for  I  consider  that  the 
welfare  of  the  city  would  be  essentially  promoted  by  this  park. 

Q  42.  Has  not  your  occupation  been  rather  that  of  a  chemist 
than  a  botanist? 

A.  No,  it  has  been  as  much,  if  not  more  that  of  a  botanist 
than  a  chemist ;  I  have  lectured  on  botany,  and  was  employed  as 
botanist  in  the  geological  survey  of  this  State. 

Q  43.    Where  do  you  reside? 

A.    At  number  96  St  Mark's  Place,  New- York. 


24  I  Senate 

Q  44'.  Would  it  not  take  some  time  to  convert  Jones'  Wood 
into  a  park  ? 

A.  I  think  Jones'  Wood  could  at  once  be  converted  into  pub- 
lic grounds,  without  much  expense. 

Q  45.  Are  not  a  large  portion  of  Uie  trees  in  Jones'  Wood, 
mere  poles  with  a  bush  on  the  top  ? 

A.  No,  on  the  contrary,  a  large  portion  of  the  trees  are  very 
well  formed,  and  but  few  are  poles  with  a  "  bush  on  the  top." 

Q  46.  Will  grass  grow  under  the  shade  of  trees  when  they 
are  thinned  out? 

A.  I  can  see  no  reason  why  grass  should  not  grow  under  trees 
that  have  been  thinned  out. 

Q  47.  Do  you  know  anything  as  to  the  value  of  this  pro- 
perty, its  size  and  extent? 

A.  No,  I  know  nothing  as  to  its  value,  nor  definitely  as  to  its 
size. 

Q  48.  Are  there  not  many  large  trees  in  the  centre  of  the 
Island  ? 

A.    Yes,  there  are  some  left. 

Q  49.  Will  a  tree,  which  is  merely  a  bush  on  the  top,  ever 
improve  ? 

A.  Yes,  they  will  improve  by  throwing  out  lower  branches  > 
this  is  to  be  seen  at  any  time,  where  trees  have  been  left  for  the 
purposes  of  shade,  in  clearing  land. 

Q  50.  In  how  many  years  will  trees  become  available  as  shade 
trees  ? 

A.  They  will  grow  up  perhaps  in  twenty-five  years,  the  trees 
in  Washington  Square  will  form  a  criterion. 

June  9th.  1853.    Examination  of  Mr,  Thomas  Hogg. 
Q.  1.  Are  you  acquainted  with  Jones'  Wood? 
A.  Yes,  I  am  well  acquainted  with  it,  for  many  years. 
Q  2.  Do  you  consider  it  well  adapted  for  a  public  park. 

A;  In  my  opinion  it  can  be  made  a  park  of,  at  a  cheaper  rate 
than  any  other  part  of  the  island  ;  it  is  well  covered  with  trees; 
has  a  fine  water  front,  and  the  growth  of  the  trees  shows  that  the 
land  is  good. 


No.  82.  j 


25 


Q  3.  Are  you  acquainted  with  horticulture  generally  ? 

A.  Yes,  for  nearly  70  years,  both  in  Great  Britain  and  this 
country. 

Q  4.  Do  you  suppose  that  if  drives  were  laid  out  through 
them,  the  trees  would  die? 

A.  Certainly  not,  have  only  to  refer  to  Greenwood  as  an  exam- 
ple, but  do  not  think  it  desirable  to  thin  out  much  in  this  climate, 
as  owing  to  our  greater'summer  heats  and  drier  climate,  our  parks 
should  be  more  shady  than  in  England. 

Q  5.  Are  you  acquainted  with  the  proposed  Central  Park, and 
if  so,  what  is  the  quality  of  the  land  ? 

A.  I  am  well  acquainted  with  the  whole  island,  from  60th  street 
to  100th  street;  it  is  pretty  fair  land, and  mightmakea  good  park, 
but  a  great  deal  of  it  is  very  rocky  and  wild,  it  would  cost  a 
very  large  sum  to  make  it  available. 

Q  Are  there  any  trees  on  the  Central  Park? 

A.  Scarcely  any,  they  were  all  cut  down  when  the  reservoir 
was  built. 

Q.  7.    Is  there  any  low  ground  in  the  Central  Park  ? 

A.  Yes,  there  is  great  deal  of  swamp,  particularly  north  of 
71st  street ;  as  you  go  from  the  3rd  to  the  8th  avenue,  there  are 
also  severa?  bone  factories  and  other  nuisances. 

Q.  8.  Suppose  there  were  no  trees  in  Jones' ~Park,  w^hich 
would  you  then  prefer  ? 

A.  I  should  prefer  Jones'  Wood  on  account  of  its  being  on  the 
river,  and  having  the  benefit  of  the  breezes  which  always  accom- 
pany the  tides. 

Q.  9.  Do  you  think  that  squares  not  bordering  on  the  river 
are  useful  ? 

A.    Yes,  as  breathing  places  for  the  city  they  are  very  useful. 
Q,  10.    Do  such  squares  promote  the  health  of  the  city. 
A.    Yes,  the  squares  we  have  at  present  are  highly  beneficial 
in  that  respect. 

Q.  11.  Would  Union  square  produce  any  greater  benefit,  if  it 
were  removed  from  its  present  locality  and  placed  at  either  end 
of  Uth  street  on  the  riirer? 


26  [Senate 

A.  Noj  it  produces,  as  it  is,  the  greatest  benefit  where  it  is,  as 
a  current  of  air  comes  up  14th  street,  and  others  adjoining  from 
either  river.  But  if  it  was  a  large  place  for  the  poorer  classes  to 
resort  to,  it  would  be  better  on  the  river ;  the  cases  are  not  alike. 

Q.  12.  Is  the  Central  park  much  lower  in  the  centre  than  the 
grade  of  the  streets  ? 

A.  It  is  exceedingly  low  in  the  centre,  and  would  have  to  be 
filled  up,  it  is  certainly  lower  than  Jones'  Wood. 

Q  13.    Does  not  the  Central  Park  include  Harlem  Heights  ? 

A.    It  does  not  take  them  in. 

Q.  14.    How  deep  is  the  soil  in  Jones'  Wood. 

A.  In  cutting  through  the  2nd  avenue  they  found  25  feet  of 
earth,  and  in  one  place  30  feet  of  rock,  with  earth  over  it. 

Q.  15.  Which  of  the  two  proposed  parks  would  be  of  the 
most  advantage  to  the  surrounding  property  I 

A.  The  central  park  would  be  of  most  advantage  to  those 
Avho  live  round  it,  when  the  Island  is  built  up,  but  tor  the  pres- 
ent generation,  Jones'  wood  is  of  m  tst  advantage. 

Q  16.  Would  the  central  park  be  more  expensive  thar  the 
Jones  wood  ? 

A.  I  do  not  know,  am  not  acquainted  with  the  value  of  the 
property. 

Q.  17.    Are  not  the  parks  about  London,  generally  at  the  in- 
tersection of  streets  1 
A.    Not  generally. 

Q  18.  Is  not  the  centre  of  the  proposed  central  park  high 
ground  ? 

A.    No  !  there  is  a  great  deal  of  low  ground  in  the  centre  up 
to  86th  street,  towards  the  8th  avenue. 
Q.  19.    What  is  your  occupation.  ? 
A.    A  nurseryman. 
Q.  20.    Where  do  you  reside  ? . 
A.    On  79th  street,  east  of  Third  avenue. 
Q.  21.    Do  you  own  the  property  where  you  reside  ? 
A.    No ;  I  lease  it,  it  is  part  of  the  Delafield  place 


No.  82. 1 


27 


Q.  22.    How  many  acres  have  you  ? 
A.    About  10  J  acres. 

Q.  23.    How  far  north  of  Jones'  wood  is  your  residence.  ? 

A.    It  is  four  blocks  north. 

Q  24.    Have  you  ever  laid  out  any  parks  ? 

A.  No ;  I  have  not  laid  them  out  but  when  a  journeyman 
gardener,  have  worked  in  laying  out  gentlemen's  places,  but  since  I 
have  been  in  business  for  myself,  I  liave  only  acted  in  an  advisory 
capacity. 

Q  25.    Who  have  you  advised  with  in  laying  out  grounds? 
A.    With  very  many  persons — ad  vised  Parmetier  in  laying  out 

the  celebrated  place  of  Dr;  Hosack,  at  Hyde  Park,  advised  with 
Dr.  Hosack  in  erecting  his  greenhouse  and  in  making  subsequent 
improvements. 

Q  26.    Do  you  not  find  that  trees  will  die  when  thinned  out? 

A.  No,  have  only  to  refer  you  to  Greenwood  and  Dr.  Hosack 's 
place  at  Hyde  Park,  where  there  were  native  woods,  through 
which  we  cut  walks,  and  thinned  them  out. 

June  9th.  1953.    Examination  of  Mr.  Benjamin  Munn. 

Q  1 .    Where  do  you  reside  ? 

A.    In  New- York. 

Q  2.   J^Vhat  is  your  occupation  ? 

A.    I  am  a  landscape  gardener. 

Q  3.    How  long  have  you  followed  this  profession  ? 

A.    For  many  years,  nearly  twenty  years. 

Q  4.    Did  you  ever  practice  it  in  Europe  ? 

A.  No,  never  in  Europe  but  in  this  country,  have  written  for 
the  magazines,  and  after  the  death  of  Mr.  Downing,  edited  the 
Horticulturist  until  Mr.  Tucker  sold  it  to  Mr.  Vick  of  Rochester. 

Q  5.  Have  you  examined  the  grounds  proposed  for  the  Jones'  • 
Wood  and  the  central  parks  ? 

A.  Yes,  have  examined  both  grounds,  the  central  from  60th 
to  100th  streets,  70th  streets  near  the  eighth  avenue  is  swampy  with 
knolls  of  rocky  ground,  covered  with  rough  brush  wood, very 
rough  ground  indeed,  from  71st  street,  it  rises  very  considerably, 
on  eighth  avenue,  does  not  rise  so  much,  above  eighty- sixth  street 
it  is  more  level,  the  ground  continues  to  rise,  but  would  require 


28 


[Senate 


much  drainage  in  order  to  be  converted  into  a  park,  the  lowest 
part  is  from  sixtieth  to  seventieth  streets. 

I  have  also  examined  Jones'  Wood  ;  went  through  it  twice  ; 
it  is  near  the  3d  avenue ;  towards  the  middle,  the  ground  is  wet ; 
draining  would  cause  the  trees  to  be  endangered,  particularly  af- 
ter cutting  out  the  paths  ;  it  would  require  a  great  deal  of  thin- 
ning out,  it  is  so  densely  wooded  ;  if  this  cutting  or  thinning  were 
done  injudiciously,  it  would  endanger  the  trees ;  I  would  not  be 
responsible  for  the  result  ten  years  after,  some  of  the  trees  would 
die. 

Q.  What  is  the  difference  between  trees  standing  alone,  and 
forest  trees  standing  close  together  I 

A.  In  trees  planted  close  together,  the  cellular  tissue  and  fibre 
and  general  texture  of  the  wood  and  bark  is  too  feeble  to  with- 
stand the  action  of  the  sun  and  air,  when  thinned  out  or  otherwise 
exposed. 

Q.  Are  you  acquainted  with  Greenwood  ? 

A.  I  do  not  know  Greenwood,  have  never  visited  it,  and  there- 
fore have  not  examined  it. 

Q.  Could  trees  be  transplanted  out  of  Jones'  Wood  ? 

A.  Single  trees  could  not  be  set  out  alone,  but  they  might  be 
set  out  in  clumps  or  belts  without  damage. 

Q.  Could  paths  be  cut  without  serious  damage  tp  the  remain- 
ing trees  ? 

A.  With  care,  they  might  be  cut  without  doing  much  damage. 

Q.  How  are  the  trees  in  Hyde  Park,  London  ? 

A.  They  are  generally  planted  in  clumps. 

Q.  Could  not  the  Central  park  be  soon  made  available  ? 

A.  That  portion  from  71st  to  86th-streets,  between  the  5th  ave- 
'    nue  and  the  reservoir,  might  soon  be  made  into  a  park. 

Q.  What  would  be  the  number  of  trees  necessary  and  the  cost 
per  acre  for  planting  the  Central  park  ? 

A.  I  cannot  form  an  approximation,  it  would  depend  upon  the 
mode  of  laying  it  out ;  the  ailanthus,  the  abele,  the  poplar,  &e., 
vary  from  fifty  cents  to  two  dollars  each. 

Q.  Which  of  the  two  proposed  sites  are  best  adapted  for  a 
park. 


No.  82.  j 


29 


A.  In  my  opinion  the  Central  park  is  best,  because  Jones' 
Wood  is  entirely  too  small,  the  situation  is  better  as  to  ingress 
and  egress  by  the  city  railways.  I  would  clearly  prefer  the  Cen- 
tral park,  as  I  would  undertake  to  make  it  a  much  finer  park  ; 
there  is  more  variety  of  surface,  its  inequalities  are  better,  should 
prefer  it,  even  if  both  were  bare  of  trees. 

Q  Which  would  be  the  best  in  a  sanitary  view  1 
A.  With  reference  to  general  health,  I  should  prefer  the  Cen- 
tral, because  it  was  central. 

Q  Would  it  be  possible  to  thin  out  Jones'  Wood,  and  if  so, 
how  long  would  it  take  ? 

A.  It  would  require  great  care  and  prudence  to  convert  Jones' 
Wood  into  a  park  ;  the  thinning  out  could  not  be  completed  in 
less  than  seven  years,  but  must  be  done  gradually. 

Q  What  is  the  general  appearance  and  size  of  the  parks  in 
Europe  ? 

A.  They  are  generallv  large  ;  that  at  Blenheim,  belonging  to 
the  Duke  of  Marlborough,  contains  12,000  acres;  they  all  planted 
in  belts,  clumps,  groups,  &c. 

Q  Could  the  reservoirs  be  made  ornamental  ? 

A.  Yes,  if  expense  w^ere  no  object  they  could  be  made  very 
ornamental  by  having  hanging  gardens,  such  as  in  old  times  were 
at  Nineveh  or  Babylon,  by  terracing  around  them  :  having  foun- 
tains, you  may  have  anything  you  desire. 

Q  By  what  legal  process  do  they  appropriate  parks  in  Eng- 
land ? 

A.  Victoria  park  was  appropriated  by  act  of  Parliament,  do  not 
know  as  to  the  others,  but  suppose  it  was  done  in  the  same 
way. 

Q  Have  you  had  any  experience  in  thinning  out  natural  woods 
in  this  country  1 

A.  No,  I  have  not  had  any. 

Q  Have  you  ever  laid  out  any  parks  in  this  country  or  Eu- 
rope ? 

A.  No,  I  have  never  laid  out  any  in  either  country. 


30 


[Senate 


June  1853.  Examination  of  Mr.  James  Hogg. 
Q  1.  What  is  your  profession  1 
A.  I  am  a  nurseryman  and  seedsman, 
Q  2.  How  long  have  you  been  so  engaged  ? 
A.  From  my  youth  at  least  for  20  years. 
Q  3.  Are  you  acquainted  with  Jones'  Wood  ' 
A.  Yes. 

Q  4.  What  is  the  topography  of  the  ground  ? 

A.  It  is  high  in  the  south-west  corner,  descending  gradually  to 
the  south-west,  and  also  gradually  descending  to  the  river,  on 
the  bank  of  which  is  a  high  bluff,  broken  where  a  stream  passing 
through  the  woods  discharges  itself ;  the  general  lay  of  the 
land  is  to  the  north. 

The  surface  is  undulating,  generally,  indeed  for  the  most  part 
the  soil  is  very  deep,  some  rocks  rise  above  the  surface,  their  gen- 
eral aspect  is  very  picturesque. 

A  great  portion  of  the  land  i?  covered  with  a  natural  growth 
of  forest  trees,  some  portions  of  it  is  pasture  and  general  farming 
lands,  including  several  orchards. 

Q  5.  What  is  the  general  character  of  the  trees  ? 

A.  They  generally  consist  of  liriodendron  or  tulip  tree,  liquid- 
amber,  different  species  of  oaks,  birch,  cedar,  elms,  &c. 

Q.  6.  How  is  it  situated  with  regard  to  the  grade  of  streets. 

A.  On  the  south  side  it  is  generally  somewhat  higher,  on  the 
north  side  somew^hat  lower. 

Q.  7.  Are  you  acquainted  with  the  proposed  central  park  ? 

A.  I  am. 

Q.  What  is  the  general  topography  of  the  grounds? 

A.  On  the  south-west  corner  it  is  low  and  swampy,  from  about 
67th  to  68th  street,  northward  to  the  reservoir  it  is  very  low  in 
the  centre,  forming  a  ravine,  but  on  the  5th  and  8th  avenue  sides 
there  are  high  rocky  ridges;  north  of  86th  street  it  is  rather  more 
level  and  less  rocky.  The  highest  portion  is  about  140  feet  above 
water  mark,  the  lowest  portion  is  but  a  few  feet  above  it,  per- 
haps as  much  as  30  to  40  feet  below  the  grade  of  the  streets. 


No.  82.]  31 

Q.  9.  What  is  the  general  character  of  tlie  trees,  if  any  upon 
it? 

A.  It  is  almost  entirely  denuded  of  trees,  particularly  the  lower 
portion ;  on  the  upper  portion  there  are  here  and  there  some 
scattered  trees,  such  as  cedars,  &c.,  and  also  some  orchards. 

Q.  10.    How  is  it  situated  as  regards  the  grade  of  the  streets? 

A.  In  some  places  it  is  nearly  100  feet  above  the  grade  ;  in 
others  again  it  is  nearly  if  not  quite  40  feet  below  the  grade,  and 
would  require  heavy  embankments,  which  would  materially  in- 
terfere W'ith  the  laying  of  it  out. 

Q.  11.  Which  is  most  eligible  for  the  purposes  of  a  public 
park  ? 

A.    Jones'  Wood. 

Q.  12.    Why  so? 

A.  Because  it  will  cost  less  to  make  it  available,  because  it  is 
already  covered  with  trees,  and  the  general  aspect  of  the  land  is 
more  readily  adapted  to  such  purpose,  and  also  because  it  can  be 
made  available  for  the  immediate  use  of  the  present  generation. 

Q.  13.  Will  trees  die  when  thinned  out,  or  when  roads  are  cut 
through  them  ? 

A.    Noj^they  will  not  when  done  judiciously. 

Q.  14.  Have  you  had  any  experience  or  made  any  observa- 
tion to  this  effect  ? 

A.  Yes ;  I  would  refer  as  instances  to  Greenwood,  Dr.  Ho- 
sack's,  at  Hyde  Park,  Wm.  Kelly,  Esq.,  at  Rhinebeck,  and  many 
other  places. 

Q.  15.  Have  you  made  botany,  more  particularly  vegetable 
physiology,  your  study  ? 

A.    I  have. 

Q.  16.  Is  your  opinion  derived  from  theoretioal  or  practical 
knowledge  ? 
A.  From  both. 

Q.  17.  Have  you  been  in  England  or  Scotland  ? 
A.  Yes,  I  have. 

Q.  Have  you  seen  any  of  the  parks  there  ? 


32  [Senate 

A.  Yes,  I  have  visited  all  the  public  parks  in  London,  and 
have  seen  the  parks  of  Lord  Derby  at  Knowlesly  Hall,  near  Li- 
verpool,  the  Marquis  of  Westminister's  at  Eaton  Hall,  near  Ches- 
ter, the  Duke  of  Buccleugh's,  at -Dalkeith,  near  Edinburgh,  and 
others. 

Q  19.  What  is  their  general  aspect '? 

A.  They  are  generally  very  large,  containing  many  hundred 
acres  ;  they  are  generally  well  wooded,  the  trees  being  in  masses 
or  large  groups,  with  thickets  or  underwood,  such  as  Rhododen- 
drons, for  the  preservation  of  game  ;  there  are  also  openings  or 
glades  of  grass,  on  which  deer  and  sometimes  cattle  run  and  feed. 

Q  20.  Do  you  advocate  the  establishing  of  parks  as  a  matter  of 
necessity,  or  as  a  matter  of  ornament  to  the  city  ? 

A.  I  advocate  them  as  matters  of  necessity. 

Q  21.  Why  as  a  necessity  ? 

A.  In  order  that  our  densely  crowded  population  on  the  East 
side  of  the  city  more  particularly,  may  have  a  place  for  recrea- 
tion, a  place  to  which  they  may  bring  their  wives  and  children, 
and  let  them  breath  the  fresh  air,  for  the  city  inspectors'  reports 
show  that  62  per  cent  of  our  mortality  is  with  those  under  ten 
years  of  age.    New-York  city  must  have  breathing  places. 

Q  22.  Have  you  made  yourself  acquainted  with  the  compara- 
tive cost  of  these  two  parks,  I  mean  as  to  first  cost. 

A.  Yes,  from  memoranda  I  have  of  the  sales  of  some  property 
in  the  central  park,  and  also  a  memoranda  I  have  of  a  small  sale 
of  the  most  eligible  portion  of  Jones'  Wood,  and  besides  these, 
from  an  examination  of  the  assessors'  book?  in  the  tax  office,  I  find 
that  the  cost  of  the  central  park  will  be  area  for  area  from  twice 
to  three  times  as  much  as  the  Jones'  Wood. 

Q  23.  What  are  your  memoranda  ? 

A.  At  the  sale  of  the  Amory  estate  in  March  1852,  seven 
blocks  or  squares,  six  of  them,  extending  from  G5th  to  71st  street, 
and  from  the  5th  to  6th  av.,  and  one  extending  from  71st  to  72d 
street,  between  (Hh  and  7th  av.,  sold  for  an  average  of  |37,402 
per  block. 

At  a  sale  of  corporation  property  in  Dec.  1852,  four  half  blocks 
and  one  whole  block,  situated  between  72nd  and  81st  streets,  and 


No.  82.]  33 

between  the  4th  and  5th,  the  5th  and  0th,  and  6th  and  7th  aven- 
ues, sold  ?t  an  average  value  of  SG7,S76  per  block. 

Last  year,  at  a  sale  of  property  on  the  2nd  and  3rd  av.,  and 
73rd  street,  twenty-two  lots  sold  for  an  average  value  of  $575  per 
lot,  nearly  all  avenue  lots  which  would  make  the  value  ot  the  most 
valuable  purtion  of  the  Jones'  Wood,  equal  to  about  §30,000  per 
block. 

This  present  year  the  Jones'  Wood  is  assessed  for  $539,600,  or 
an  average  value  of  $14,988  per  block. 

Seven  blocks  distributed  in  the  proposed  central  park,  are 
assessed  for  an  average  value  of  $31 ,720  per  block. 

These  are  selected  from  60th  to  67th  streets,  and  from  5th  to 
8th  avenues,  and  are  among  the  most  rocky  and  least  eligible  of 
that  portion  of  the  city. 

Q.  24.  Do  you  know  wdiy  it  is  proposed  to  make  the  central 
park  ? 

A.  The  Common  Council  proposed  to  ma1  e  it,  because  the  pro- 
perty on  its  proposed  site  is  so  rocky  and  so  badly  situated  as  to 
grade,  &c.,  that  it  would  be  an  enormous  assessment  on  its  owners 
to  have  it  graded. 

Q.  24.  What  would  be  the  after  cost  of  planting  and  laying 
out  the  central  park  ? 

A.  It  would  require  at  least  $1,500  per  acre,  on  account  of  the 
necessity  of  grading  and  bringing  in  soil  to  many  parts  of  it. 

Q.  26.  How  do  the  two  localities  compare  as  to  healthiness  ? 

A.  It  is  healthy  around  Jones'  Wood,  but  the  site  of  the  pro- 
posed Central  Park  is  universally  admitted  to  be  unhealthy. 

Q.  27.  What  would  be  the  ultimate  cost  of  laying  out  Jones' 
Wood? 

A.  Not  to  exceed  $200  per  acre. 

Q  27.  W^ere  you  acquainted  with  the  late  Mr.  Downing'? 
A.  I  was  well  acquainted  with  him  1 

Q.  Have  you  any  knowledge  of  his  views  as  to  thinning  out 
trees? 

[Stiute  No.  82.]  3  . 


34  [Senate 

A.  YeSj  he  approved  of  it.  and  -when  he  laid  out  the  public 
grounds  at  Washington,  he  much  regretted  that  the  natural  wood 
had  all  been  cleared  olf.  In  order  to  produce  an  immediate  effect^ 
he  paid  enormous  prices,  sometimes  as  iiigh  as  $20  per  tree,  for 
those  planted  in  Franklin  Square,  and  around  the  Smithsonian 
Institute. 

Q.  30.  Could  the  present  and  proposed  reservoirs  be  made 
available  for  purposes  of  ornament  in  the  Central  Park  ? 

A.  Owing  to  their  being  elevated  the  water  itself  could  not  be 
made  ornamental,  and  the  supply  of  Croton  water  is  not  suffi- 
cient for  the  fountains  we  already  have,  let  alone  any  others  as 
proposed  for  the  Central  Park.  At  a  very  enormous  expense 
hanging  gardens  or  terraces  might  be  made  to  disguise  the  un- 
sightly walls  of  the  reservoirs. 

Q  31.  How  is  Jones'  wood  situated  as  to  the  centre  of  popu- 
lation 1 

A.  I  judge  the  centre  of  population  to  be  somewhere  in  the 
vicinity  of  Delancy  or  Houston-street,  and  that,  consequently^ 
it  would  be  accessible  to  two-thirds  of  our  population  by  means 
of  the  1st,  2nd,  3d  and  4th  avenue  railroads. 

Q.  32.  Have  you  visited  Greenwood  ? 

A.  Yes. 

Q.  33.  How  does  draining  and  thinning  out  the  trees  in  the 
lower  portion  of  the  grounds  affect  them  1 

A.  Not  at  all  disadvantageously — they  have  thinned  them  out 
severely  around  some  of  the  lakelets,  but  the  trees  have  not  suf- 
fered much  injury. 

Q.  34.    Are  you  personally  interested  in  this  matter? 

A.    No,  not  in  any  way. 

Q.  35.    Are  any  of  your  family. 

A.  No.  My  father  has  a  lease  of  some  property  on  79th  street, 
near  2nd  avenue,  but  by  the  terms  of  his  lease  it  can  only  be  used 
for  nursery  purposes. 

Q.  36.  Are  you  acquainted  with  the  owners  of  the  surround- 
ing property  1 

A»    I  am  with  Some  of  them. 


No.  82.]  35 

Q.  37.  Are  you  acquainted  with  any  of  the  owners  of  the 
property  proposed  to  be  purchased  ? 

A.    I  know  some  of  them  slightly. 

Q.    What  are  the  feelings  of  either,  or  both  in  tliis  matter? 

A.  There  is  a  great  diversity  of  feeling.  General  Jones  and 
Mr.  Schermerhorn  oppose  it;  others  are  indifferent,  and  so  are 
many  of  those  who  own  surrounding  property. 

Q.  39.  Are  you  paid  to  advocate  this  measure  before  the 
Senate. 

A.  Not  by  anybody,  in  any  shape  or  form. 

Q.  40.    Have  any  inducements  been  held  out  to  you,  so  to  do 

A.    None  at  all. 

Q.  41.  Why  do  you  advocate  a  park,  and  Jones'  Wood  in  par- 
ticular ? 

A.  I  have  a  bill  before  this  Le2;islature  authorisins;  the  Com- 
mon  Council  of  our  city  to  give  the  free  use  of  a  portion  of  any 
public  park  that  may  be  hereafter  created,  to  our  Horticultural 
Society,  for  the  purpose  of  founding  a  Horticultural  garden,  and 
if  we  have  no  park  we  have  no  garden. 

I  advocate  the  Jones'  W^ood  in  particular,  because  of  its  adapta- 
bility, and  iijimediate  availability  to  the  public. 

Q.  42.  By  whom  are  you  intiueutially  sustained  in  this 
matter  I 

A.  By  the  president  and  other  members  of  the  N.Y.  Horticul- 
tural Society. 

Q.  43.  Are  any  of  these  persons  personally  interested? 
A.  None  that  I  know  of. 

Q.  44.  Was  the  cost  of  fence  included  in  your  estimate  for  im- 
proviDg  Jones'  AVood  ? 

A.  No,  nor  either  in  that  for  the  Central  Park. 
Q.  45.  If  roads  and  paths  were  cut  through  would  the  trees 
die? 

A.  No,  as  a  proof  of  this,  there  is  a  road  in  Jones'  W^ood,  cut 
by  Mr.  Langdon,  within  the  past  five  years,  and  the  bordering 
trees  did  not  die. 


36 


I  Senate 


Q  40.  Is  it  desirable  to  preserve  the  natural  forest,  are  not  ex- 
otic trees  more  valuable  for  the  purposes  of  ^liade  and  ornament  ? 

A.  The  native  trees  are  far  the  most  desirable,  and  in  all  re- 
spects greatly  superior  to  exotic  trees. 

Q  47.  What  is  the  character  of  the  river  opposite  Jones'  Wood, 
is  it  easily  navigable  for  vessels  of  any  class  1 

A.  The  current  is  very  strong  and  rapid,  so  much  so,  that  the 
most  powerful  steamboats  never  attempt  to  stem  it  when  the  tide 
runs  strongly,  say  at  half  tide. 

Q.  48.  What  do  you  understand  when  apersom  speaks  of  hav- 
ing laid  out  a  place,  do  you  mean  that  he  gave  the  design  or  that 
he  labored  in  carrying  out  the  design  ] 

A.  The  term  is  used  loosely  and  indiscriminately,applying  some- 
times to  one  and  sometimes  to  the  other,  they  bear  the  same  re 
lation  to  each  as  that  of  an  architect  to  a  builder. 

Q  49  Could  the  Central  Park  be  easily  drained  ? 

A  It  would  be  drained  with  great  difficulty,  sew^ers  |  of  a  mile 
in  length  would  have  to  be  especially  constructed  to  carry  the 

wa'er  off  to  either  river. 

Q  50.  Would  it  be  necessary  to  carry  any  of  the  cross  streets 
through  it  ? 

A  Yes,  every  100  feet  street  would  have  to  be  carried  through 
it  in  order  to  give  access  from  one  side  of  the  Island  to  ihe  other. 

Q   What  would  be  the  effect  of  so  doing  ? 

A  It  w^ould  materially  interfere  wath  the  laying  out,  as  the 
embankments  and  cuts  necessary  for  the  streets,  would  destroy 
its  unity. 

June  17,  1853.  Mr.  Samuel  J.  Gustin,  a  gardener  and  nursery- 
man of  New-Jersey,  appeared  before  the  chairman  of  the  select 
committee,  and  stated  that  his  experience  taught  him  to  prefer 
planted  groves  to  natural  forest  for  ornamental  purposes.  He  in- 
stanced two  gentlemen's  seats  in  New-Jersey,  one  of  which  re- 
tained the  original  forest  trees,  the  other  had  been  planted  with- 
in thirty  years;  the  latter  has  now  far  the  most  beautiful  wood. 


No.  82.]  37 

Mr.  Gustin  thinks  the  Central  park  preferable  to  the  other,  be- 
cause it  will  aftbrd  better  opportuniiy  for  skiUuU  planting  and 
fine  ellisct;  Jones'  Wood  does  not  possess, in  his  opinion,  the  same 
advantages,  being  already  gro.wn  over  in  great  part  with  native 
timber. 


> 


